Unlock the secrets to thriving in the intricate dance of medical sales with insights from
Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary a distinguished neurosurgeon with a wealth of knowledge on
the clinician-sales rep dynamic. Prepare to have your perspective transformed as we
dissect the crucial elements of trust, preparedness, and communication that define
successful collaborations. Dr. Chowdhary pulls from his vault of experience to guide
medical sales professionals in making a genuine impact, discussing the fine balance
between presenting product value and respecting competitors, as well as the nuances
of interaction within the bustling environment of the OR.
Embark on a thought-provoking exploration of the future that awaits medical sales
representatives, delving into the changing roles, the rise of specialized knowledge, and
the anticipation of industry certifications. The conversation with Dr. Chowdhary
illuminates the complexities of product implementation, navigating the maze of hospital
bureaucracy, and the shifting paradigm toward Ambulatory Surgery Centers. This
episode is your compass to understanding the evolving healthcare landscape and
establishing enduring relationships with medical professionals.
Experience a candid reflection on the personal and professional journeys of surgeons,
from the evolving culture of orthopedics to the introspective world of neurosurgery.This
episode is not just a learning opportunity—it’s an invitation to peer through the lens of a
seasoned surgeon and grasp the profound connections between individual growth,
patient care, and the art of medical sales.
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Episode Transcript
00:00 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Hello and welcome to the Medical Sales Podcast. I’m your host, Samuel, founder of a revolutionary medical sales training and mentorship program called the Medical Sales Career Builder, and I’m also host of the Medical Sales Podcast. In this podcast, I interview top medical sales reps and leading medical sales executives across the entire world. It doesn’t matter what medical sales industry from medical device to pharmaceutical, to genetic testing and diagnostic lab you name it you will learn how to either break into the industry, be a top 10% performer within your role or climb the corporate ladder. Welcome to the Medical Sales Podcast and remember, I am a medical sales expert, sharing my own opinion about this amazing industry and how it can change your life. Welcome to the Medical Sales Podcast. I’m your host, Samuel, and today we have with us a very special guest, and he goes by the name Dr Chowdhary.
01:00
Who is Dr Chowdhary, you ask? He’s a neurosurgeon. I’m going to leave it there. He’s a neurosurgeon and he’s going to explain exactly where he hails from and what he specializes in. But if you’re listening to this right now, this is an episode you absolutely have to listen to.
01:16
It’s imperative that you not only learn and hear from sales reps and senior leaders and all these medical sales companies. You need to hear from the other side, from the providers themselves, and a neurosurgeon like Dr Chowdhary today, who’s a very eloquent speaker, does other things outside of just being a clinician is going to give you insights that I challenge all of you to really take in. You know this episode is, of course, for people that want to break in, but this is actually incredibly valuable to those of you that do this every single day. Maybe you’re looking to be a manager, Maybe you’re looking to be a second line leader, Maybe you’re looking to get into a different field and you’re thinking to yourself how can I be more impactful with my customers? This is the episode for you. As always, we do our best to bring you guests that are doing things differently in the medical sales space, so I really do hope you enjoy this episode of the Medical Sales Podcast. Hello, Dr Chowdhary. How are we doing today?
02:11 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Doing well and yourself Tim.
02:12 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
I am fantastic. Why don’t you tell everybody who you are and what you do?
02:17 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
My name is Abinit Chowdhary. I’m a neurosurgeon in Scottsdale, arizona. I do both brain, spine and endovascular neurosurgery. I work for my own group called the Southwest Associates of Neurosurgery, or SWAN, with a couple of partners and yeah, I’m looking forward to this discussion today.
02:40 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Absolutely, so let’s talk about it. A lot of our listeners, many of our listeners, are in the industry as medical sales reps. Some of them are physicians, just like yourself, and some of them are sales leaders. And some of them want to get into the industry and they don’t really know the ins and outs of what makes up this industry. So, as a neurosurgeon, talk to us a little bit about the different types of medical sales reps you work with of medical sales reps you work with.
03:05 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Sure, as you can imagine, I’m sometimes intimidated with reps because we have components of spine reps for spine hardware procedures, cranial reps for oncology reasons, cranial plating reasons, hemostatic agents On the endovascular side, reps for stroke, reps for aneurysm coils, reps for intracranial and carotid stents, and then on the hospital and surgery center side you know there’s other equipment needs that we have, from everything from beds to OR equipment to lights, to even workflow and marketing, so kind of the full gamut of exposure to the industry in that regards.
03:51 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Wow, you know, I didn’t even know you saw that many different types of reps, doctor. That is quite a breadth of different types of reps. So you know that actually gives us a good segue to what I want to discuss, because I want to talk about what makes a great rep. However, considering you see so many different types of reps, maybe we should segment it into what makes a good rep in the OR, what makes a great rep outside of the OR. Let’s start with the OR, so for those reps that you work with that are doing procedures, are in there while you’re doing procedures, talk to us about what makes a good rep. What do you expect to see? What do you expect them to show up with to allow you to do all the good work that you do?
04:37 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Sure, I think it’s actually probably applies to all settings. The number one thing to be a good rep is to be a good partner, and that is about trust. So it’s being able to develop that trust that you have the processes, the equipment and the troubleshooting knowledge for what we’re doing that day. So in the OR you know, for example, it’s really, really helpful when anything you do that makes my life easier is valued. So if you show up early and you confirm that your trays are there, that they’re sterile, that they’ve sterilized them correctly, there’s not holes in the wrap or they forgot to sterilize it and help the OR get set up well, that makes my life easier because that means I’m not getting phone calls, I’m not being delayed at the beginning of the day which then pushes through the whole day. So I think that’s a number one way to build trust and start the relationship, which is to be prepared to show up and make sure that you’re not the problem in the delays. It can be anesthesia, it can be the patient, it could be something else, but you’ve done that part and, honestly, it also helps, even when it’s not your fault, if you’re the first one to communicate it to me like hey, you know, dr Chowder, just so you know it looks like we’re going to be delayed a little bit because X, y and Z is going on, because you’re in the room. You’re in the room and you have your pulse directly on as to what’s going on, and so that helps build that trust and that relationship and this whole industry.
06:15
The number one thing is relationship building. Everything else is kind of the means to that end, because you may be with the same company your whole career. That’s pretty rare. You know you’ll jump from one company to another for various promotion reasons, other reasons. So to have that relationship is the key. And with any relationship, the key to building it is building that trust that you can provide something that others can’t Trust, that you can provide something that others can’t Gotcha.
06:47 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Okay, so now I’m going to take you through a little scenario and just indulge me in tips on how this person can show up. So let’s pretend I just got the position. I’m a brand new rep. Let me ask you this what would you say is probably the most competitive? You this what would you say is probably the most competitive? Out of all the reps you deal with, what are the most competitive? Which field has the most competition when it comes to reps?
07:12 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Most likely spine. You know, just because of the there’s a plethora of reps, plethora of companies. You know there’s enough money involved that you know everyone wants a piece of the pie. So I would say spine is probably the most competitive.
07:25 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Makes sense. So let’s pretend I’m a new spine rep. It’s my first day. You’ve worked with my counterpart, so you have a relationship with my company, but you have no idea who I am and I want to make my best impression. I’ve already shown up early. I’ve already prepped for our procedure. We’re going to be, I guess. Well, actually, why don’t you tell me what do you expect from the communication? From that point on, knowing that you’re going to be working with this new rep, what are you expecting to see from me to allow us to start off on the right foot?
07:54 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Sure, I think you know one of the keys is and everyone should remember this, this applies to every industry there’s not a one size fits all answer to anything. You know, I can tell you what I want, which might be different than what my colleague wants, which might be different than what our other colleague wants, so it’s really the ability to read the room. That’s the most important thing. That’s where, when I talk about being prepared, it’s not like knowing what surgery you’re going to do that day. That’s just a fundamental thing you have to do to be there. It’s not like knowing what surgery you’re going to do that day. That’s a just a fundamental thing you have to do to be there. It’s really have you talked to that senior rep that’s worked with me before? You’ve gotten you know the little clues, or you know their notebook of information of what I? What I want to know and that is really the key is that’s the preparedness.
08:41
It’s similar to if a nurse, a brand new nurse, calls me about a question on a patient and she’s not asked her colleague who’s a more senior nurse, and it’s a very simple question, and when you do that, nothing wrong with it, but when you do that, you come off as being inexperienced and a novice. And all of us, no matter what field you’re in, when you start off you’re a novice, no matter how much experience, how smart you are. So it’s not that you’re not a novice and you’re trying to lie about it, but you’re showing. Hey, you know I’ve done my due diligence. You know, I know that you like instrument X, or you know this doctor likes instrument Y or they like this setup. So you know part of it is that you’ve done your preparedness by finding out from someone else that you that’s worked with that doctor, kind of what they like.
09:33
The second part is even trickier. The second part is knowing what mood I’m in that day, or what mood that surgeon is in that day, or that operator or whomever it is in that day, because that will play heavily into how they react to anything, whether positive news, negative news, neutral news. So that’s where your first sort of hello or your introduction, it’s really about trying to figure out what the surgeon’s headspace is that day, because that can make your day go great even when things go badly, or make it go horrible even when the surgery goes well.
10:12 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Can you please paint a picture for us of what you’re talking about?
10:17 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Sure being in the OR. It’s similar to what I tell patients when they think about the operating room. That’s the scariest thing for them, right? That’s all. When they think about the operating room, that’s the scariest thing for them, right? That’s all they have to think about. Their day is I have a problem. I need to get it fixed. Well, my day is what does the hospital administrator tell me that day? What’s going on in my clinic, what’s going on in the OR, what’s going on with past patients phone calls, what’s going on at home?
10:46
For some people that have a problem managing their emotions, it could be that traffic really set them off that day coming in, you know, and they’re just in that mood, and so really, it’s about understanding what the mood is of the room and reading that first and foremost. So yes, you’re prepared for the surgery. Yes, you’ve got your instruments sterilized, you helped. So, yes, you prepared for the surgery. Yes, you’ve got your instruments sterilized, you helped.
11:11
Let’s say you’ve done all that, and you always do that, and that day I’m just having a bad day. You know something, something happened, you know, like a patient had a problem overnight and the surgery went great the day before, and so I’m thinking about that, that it’s kind of annoying when you’re telling me all the things you’ve done, you know, to prepare for the day, because I expect you to have done those Other days. You know you’re in a good mood, you weren’t on call the night before, you got plenty of rest and then it’s like, oh man, and you’re telling me all these great things you’ve done to make my day easier and I’m loving it. So you know. That’s my takeaway, which is you cannot get a one-size-fits-all for the same surgeon, much less every surgeon, and so learning to read the room is the most important trait and skill set that you can work on. Wow, wow.
11:59 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Okay, in your experience, when you have new reps, do you kind of what’s your normal way of doing things? Do you kind of want to take them under your wing, kind of show them the ropes? Do you kind of hang back and say let’s see how they, based on all these things we’re talking about today, let’s see how they show up with these things. What’s your normal approach with a new representative?
12:23 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
The way I view it is. You know, my obligation in that OR is to one person only and that’s the patient. So I view it as you know, it’s the companies or the managers or the senior sales rep job to train the person. I do want them to ask questions rather than make assumptions. So you know, I don’t view it as it’s my job to train them or take them under my wing. I will, in the sense that if they ask me questions, especially if it’s a good day, you know things are going perfectly more than happy to answer every question, no matter how silly. But my caveat for me specifically is if you ask a question and I give you an answer, I expect you to know that answer next time.
13:06
So if you say, hey, what are we looking at on this MRI, what are the things you’re looking for, and I go through it on the MRI, what I’m looking for, I expect that next time we’re looking at the MRI, at least that information you either wrote down the first day I told you and then you followed up on it.
13:23
But if you ask me that again, then I’ll be like, oh, this person’s just. You know they’re either trying to butter me up or waste my time, you know, and so it’s. That’s a personal, you know, sort of approach that I take to it, which is I’m happy to um, even with a senior. You know, sometimes I’ll get a senior fine rep who, you know, amazingly doesn’t know how to read an MRI or look at an MRI or load an MRI, and I’d be like you know, here’s how we load it, you know here’s why we load it this way, and if you do this you’ll get 90% of the information. Maybe somebody wants something else that can change it. But if I walk in the room and this is up, I feel like the room is ready for the day they’ve prepared.
14:02 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
You know, everyone’s on the same page, like the room is ready for the day they’ve prepared. You know everyone’s on the same page when it comes to. You know, especially with new representatives, there’s this challenge that that we hear where, when do I actually sell to my provider? You know I got to be there to be the resource for the actual procedures and whatnot. But I also have this bag of other opportunities that I want to kind of leverage, but I’m not sure when’s the appropriate time to do it. What would you say to that for the new folks?
14:30 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
I mean just view it as any relationship you have. You know you have to be able to read the relationship. You know is this the time, and it’s understanding that timing when you show up, you know your real goal is to when I say show up, I mean for the first time or the first few times is to build that relationship or trust. You know you can even make it, as you know, remedialist calling it’s like dating. You know the first date you don’t lay all your baggage out, you don’t open your bag of goodies. You know you. You know you have to kind of feel out the other person and see what they’re receptive to. Some people are never receptive to anything. Some people are receptive to everything. And then the other way of looking at it is why are they receptive to it? Like, what component of this new thing are they going to be the most into?
15:26
Going back to the earlier question you asked, I think one of the basics of how to be a great rep, not even a good rep do not badmouth other reps and other companies. When you do that one, you seem like everybody else. Two, a lot of that is often marketing given by your company to you. It’s kind of a unidirectional marketing. It’s not an evenly weighted one. So if I know information outside of that and you’re telling me how product X causes Y problem and I know it’s BS, you kind of lose credibility.
16:01
And so don’t bad mouth like tell me about your product. Tell me why you think it’s. You know why it’s going to make my practice or my patients lives better or the hospitals cost less. You know tell me why I should use your product, but not in relation to saying because this other product you know this other product is a piece of crap or it causes this problem. You know you don’t have to tell me that if that product is crap. I know that and you know. You tell me why your product is better. And I think when you keep your head above board like that, you stay out of the gossip and the riffraff that sometimes you know pervades the industry.
16:39 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Absolutely. You know. One thing that I don’t think is talked about enough is how, when you know in a lot of cases you’re doing a procedure and there’ll be multiple competitors in the same room oh yeah, you know a lot of new not in people that want to get into the industry. They have no concept of what that is. Could you go ahead and paint a picture for us of what that looks like and talk to us a little bit about the sales dynamic in that, the competitive dynamic in that, when that’s happening?
17:07 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Sure, I mean I’ve had. You know, I think my record is five different reps in a case, you know, for all the different components and it’s. You know it could be the microscope rep you know that’s in there who’s not competing with a spine rep. But you know, when you have all these people here’s. So view it as an opportunity. When you have all these reps whether they’re your competitors, different industry, just like they’re trying to build a relationship with me, build one with them.
17:30
You know, if the Microsoft rep is, you know you become friendly with them. Maybe they can help you out down the road as you come out with a new product. Maybe that’s a robot and you know they can become a service. You know person for that. Maybe the person that does the hemostatics will be a future colleague. So that’s the way I would view it. I’m a bit of an idealist. I think the goal of everyone in the room should be the same thing, which is the patient have the best outcome. If you view it in that light, then it doesn’t matter what product you’re selling. It doesn’t matter what you’re viewed in that light and I’ve had reps offer me a competitor’s product because they think it’s better in that situation.
18:15 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
And you’ve appreciated that significantly.
18:17 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
I appreciate it, it’s trust. In fact, the last time that happened, I didn’t even use the competitor’s product, but to me, you know, to me I took note, I said, hey, they’re looking out for the patient. And this goes back to, I think, for you know, those of your listeners that listen to the Joe Rogan podcast, he talks about this with comics and you know, in the industry, when he grew up, how everyone was so cutthroat. And I think when you go into life with a starvation mentality, which is if someone else is eating, I’m starving, versus we can all eat, if you go into it, that I’ll starve if someone else succeeds, or you let that jealousy creep in, that’s when the bad things happen. That’s when you get into situations where you can get into trouble and you can burn relationships. In some relationships it’s fine if you burn them Some of them you don’t want to, but it’s best not to burn any.
19:12 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Well said, dr Wilson. So let’s go back into the room now. I want to hear and you know, indulge us what are some situations that you can recall where the rep surprised you. You know, I love how you kind of differentiated the good rep from the great rep. Give us some of those actions that were taken or those experiences, situations where the rep did something and you said, wow, this is what I want to continue to see. This is fantastic.
19:42 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Yeah, so I was having an issue with a product that the rep had brought in, where it was a spine hardware. The device wasn’t quite working the way I wanted it to work. Finally got it to work and then it was time to do some of the adjuncted things we do, like allograft or autograft, where we add extra bone, and they actually said, uh, they were there. Hey, you know, I work with this other doc and he’s, you know, he told us that he’s had much better results with fusion using this product, which wasn’t theirs. Uh, you know. Uh, he goes, you know, and doing this technique with this hardware and um. So you know, that’s uh, like they had no reason to tell me that. You know I, their product was approved, it was there, but they’re like, you know this other guy, you know I was just talking to him recently. He said he was getting like a higher fusion rate by doing.
20:34
This product was a cheaper product, it was a competitor’s product and they’re like you know that’s. That’s unusual for someone to take that step, because the differences are marginal. Unless you’re the patient. You know whether it’s 2% or 5% difference. The patient had either worked or it didn’t. It’s zero or a hundred, but they were willing to say you know, I’m working with this other person a lot, you know, they’ve told me this and they didn’t even tell it to me to say, hey, use the other product.
21:03
They told it to me as only information. You know, it was just more like hey, you know? Hey, by the way, I was talking to, you know, dr So-and-so the other day and he was, you know, saying this what do you think about it? Right? So it wasn’t use mine, use theirs, it was. I’m just passing on information, because here’s the one thing you have to remember no matter how many spine surgeries I do as a rep, after probably two, two to five years you will see five to ten x what I do, because you have to go every day to a surgeon’s OR I only do my days. This is the truth.
21:41 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Yeah, how many? And be honest with me here do most surgeons share that sentiment or would you say it’s very varied and some surgeons don’t see it that way at all.
21:52 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Oh, it’s, like I said, very varied, and this is going back to knowing what that surgeon wants to hear, or how they work and how they feel that day. Some people don’t want to hear what anyone else is doing because they think they’re the best, and that’s fine. I mean, it’s just a reality. And some people have no confidence and they just want to hear what everybody else is doing and everyone’s somewhere in between and everyone’s somewhere in between. So, even the ones that think they’re the best, they’re always open, whether they let you in and out or not, just hear what others are doing, but they’re going to make a decision on their own. Nothing you’re going to say is going to change their minds.
22:33
And then it’s also understanding that, as a good or great rep, is knowing what your information, how it’s going to be processed by that person and you know are they going to is it actually going to change what they do. You know, if another rep brings me a white paper that their manager told them to show me about some study from their company, that’s great, but you know that’s so the manager can check off their box. You know, from my perspective, it’s the information that’s included in that. Even the synopsis is all the rep really needs to know, and then they can leave the white paper with me and if I want to know more I can read it. But it’s kind of pushing stuff to justify the cost of research projects et cetera. That comes off putting when you’re trying to build these relationships, sure.
23:23 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
I love that. So let’s switch gears a little bit. I want to talk about when a representative is trying to get your attention that you do not have a relationship with. You don’t have a relationship with their company. You don’t have a relationship with any of their senior leadership or managers or any of their colleagues. What are some of the ways that you are actually receptive to meeting for lack of a better word a stranger in your field, that’s, a new rep that you could benefit from their business if they got the chance to actually speak with you.
23:54 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Sure. Well, let me tell you a couple of ways I have interacted with them and I’ll tell you which ones I prefer personally. You know I’ve walked into my office and there’s handwritten notes on marketing material left. You know, daily for weeks there could be someone I run into into the OR that stops me. You know, if I’m scrubbing in they’re like oh hey, dr Chowdhary, you know I’m mad. I’m the new rep for this. You know I’d love to get a chance to talk to you about it.
24:20
Emails are another way. Usually I don’t get phone calls or texts, but it’s usually emails, those handwritten notes at the office or notes at the office or, you know, these sort of impromptu meetings in the public setting in the hospital. Now, everyone’s going to have a different receptiveness in those scenarios. And going back to my earlier discussion of it also depends if I’m having a crap day and things are going slow and I’m scrubbing in and you talk to me, you could be selling me gold for a penny and I’m going to tell you to go pound sand. So it’s also knowing when that is and sometimes that’s asking around. Become friends with the scrub techs, with the rad techs, the x-ray team, and just ask them hey, what kind of mood is Dr So-and-so in today? Like, get that information. Secondarily, you don’t even have to get it firsthand and, honestly, the scrub techs and the PAs and MPs and the first assist, they’re probably going to have the most intimate knowledge of how they’re because they’ve interacted with that person routinely, so they’ll have the best idea of you know what kind of mood they’re in that day, of what kind of mood they’re in that day. After that, then it’s really about how do you get that information that you’re trying to get to that provider, and it just depends.
25:46
I mean, I personally hate handwritten notes. I think it’s like I get why people do it. It’s like one of those business 101s. It’s supposed to seem more personal. I hate when people just drop off marketing material. I’d rather have a one-on-one discussion, uh, because then I can ask questions, uh about, uh, what I have questions about of that technology. So for me I’m more than happy, you know, in between cases or since turnover is always a couple of hours, you know to go grab a coffee with someone and just be like, all right, tell me, you know, tell me, uh, what you want to tell me, and then I can ask you questions.
26:20 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
I can already see everybody listening. That’s in your territory right now. That’s like, okay, I’m going to get coffee with Dr Chattery on Monday. Okay, no, that’s great. Very insightful to know, you know. Another thing I wanted to ask you about is when it comes to clinical specialists versus sales reps, you know we, you know us. On the other side, we have a very. They exist in all companies and some companies call them other things. When you hear that, what does that mean to you?
26:50 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
To me. Usually where my interaction with them was, they were, for example, in my endovascular world. They were an angiotech and they’re brought on to the. So they have hands-on experience of doing the procedures and they’re brought in to help on the hands-on side versus the sales and marketing side. So that’s kind of the impetus for them and some are more skilled than others, some are better salespeople than others. I don’t view them as salespeople per se. I view them as you know, technical adjuncts, where you know they can help maybe me, but more importantly, they can help the OR NGO team because they physically you know they were a scrub tech or they were an NGO tech, so they know how to set up the table or how to set up the devices and how they interact.
27:40 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Do you hold them to a completely different standard that you hold your reps to? Oh, absolutely.
27:45 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Yeah, no, I view them as you know. They’re the hands-on people and the reps are the sales and marketing people. You know a great rep is both. You know they can help with the hands-on, but you but kind of as broad categories. The clinical specialist is really meant to be a procedural adjunct and the rep is really there for marketing and sales.
28:15 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
You clearly have the same understanding we do, okay, so then, on that note, when you have a sales rep that used to be a nurse or used to be a chiropractor or used to be some study clinician so I’m not necessarily talking about scrub techs, I’m talking about someone that went to you know, got an advanced degree in some technical trade Do you see them the same as a rep that got his degree from you know college and advanced degree in some technical trade? Do you see them the same as a rep that got his degree from you know college and didn’t do anything afterwards? Or do you? Do you give them different layers? How do you, how do you perceive that?
28:49 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
It’s just to me, it’s the same. You know, the person is a person in front of me, I don’t. I don’t. This also is true of my colleagues. You know, I don’t really care what titles you have after your name, it’s can you do the job or not. My original when I started residency, right when I was coming on, the old chairman was leaving and he used to have this thing. Dumb enough to get the job done and you can overthink or overanalyze anything. Put as many titles after your name as you want possible. It doesn’t mean you know what you’re doing, just get the job done.
29:24 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
You can’t argue with that. That’s fantastic. I hope you’re enjoying today’s episode and I want to let you know our programs cover the entire career of a medical sales professional, from getting into the medical sales industry to training on how to be a top performer in the medical sales industry, to masterfully navigating your career to executive level leadership. These programs are personalized and customized for your specific career and background and trained by over 50 experts, including surgeons. Results speak for ourselves and we’re landing positions for our candidates in less than 120 days in top medical technology companies like Stryker, medtronic, merck, abbott you name it. Would you run an Ironman race without training and a strategy? You wouldn’t, so why are you trying to do the same with the medical sales position? You need training, you need a strategy and you need to visit evolveyoursuccesscom, fill out the application schedule some time with one of our account executives and let’s get you into the position that you’ve always dreamed of. Okay, so now let’s talk about medical sales as a whole.
30:29
I remember gosh 20 years ago now, when I first started, they used to say in the future, they’re not going to have these guys, there’s just not going to be any need for them. It’s going to be AI or robots. They’re not going to have these guys. There’s just not going to be any need for them. It’s going to be AI or robots or it’s just there’s going to find a way to just not have a need. And, as we’ve seen, there’s probably more medical sales reps that are actively working than there ever have been. What would you say, what can we anticipate and this is strictly your opinion over the next 10 years on what it’s going to look like to either? Do you anticipate working with more medical sales reps? Do you think it’s going to dwindle a little bit? Do you think it’s going to change completely? Give us your thoughts.
31:05 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Sure. Well, I’ll tell you what I would like to have happen. It’s not going to happen. Here’s what I would like to have happen. You know what we’ve across the board, especially with the pandemic, it just accelerated it. People have been either quietly quitting or quitting the medical field, especially with the lower paying jobs. You know the scrub techs, the OR nurses, rehab techs. You know, with the pandemic they traveled more. You know they got, which got them a big boost and a lot of them just left the industry altogether. You know, as I was talking at my old job with the COO on why we were having problems hiring MAs and office staff, he said well, we compete against Chick-fil-A and Target and they have better benefits and they pay the same.
31:51 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Hey, it is what it is.
31:53 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Right, and so that’s the reality. So at the end of the day, I still need help in the OR. I can’t run the back table and do the surgery as efficiently as if I had someone there that knew what they were doing. In the ideal world, the medical device industry would have a standardization or certification process where they’re certified to actually scrub in and assist, because no one knows your instrumentation better than you. No scrub tech will know it better than you, because you have one job it’s to know your stuff. The scrub tech might be my scrub tech in spine, might be my scrub tech in a brain surgery, might be someone else’s scrub tech for a robotic laparoscopic hysterectomy. So they have to know a little bit of a lot of things, which means they cannot have a deep knowledge of anything. And so if there was a certification process for the reps to be able to scrub in instead of your laser pointer telling them what to do, like their cats, that would be ideal.
32:56
So I don’t think they’re going away, but I think, like with all things, what happens is everything is getting commoditized. You know you guys have to wear those stupid paper straps. You know, like why. You know there’s how many different certification things do they have for you to get in the hospital rep tracks and all these other ones you have to pay an annual fee for, and each hospital may have a different one From the company standpoint. You know the approval of their products. You know there’s how many different. There’s Oracle systems, there’s Greenlight. You know there’s all these other, all these things that you have to outweigh money to. That doesn’t necessarily give you a return, and that, I think, is that is what’s been the biggest problem.
33:41
The commoditization is that doesn’t help patients. You know, I think you guys help patients. Whether, though, even the worst sales rep, you know, helps patients, the best ones help them a lot. You know. They make the surgeries go smoother. Anything that reduces stress in the OR makes surgeries go better. So any way that you can reduce that stress by making everyone more comfortable the rep, the circulating nurse, the surgeon, the mid-level anesthesia, x-ray tech that makes better patient care. So I think I agree with you it’s not going away, you know. It’s. In fact, it’ll probably become more prevalent and, honestly, I’m sure I’m not the first one that’s thought of this, but whoever can commoditize that certification process, they’re going to win.
34:31 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Yeah, no, I hear you, you know you’re right. I mean, the competition with trying to commoditize this certification process has made things so muddy, um and, to your point, has made it impossible in some cases for reps to get the access they’re supposed to get to be able to be a true resource and assistance to you. So it is interesting to see where that’s going to go. But you’re saying that if somebody I guess that’s doing this monopolized the commoditization of it and figured out an overall standardized system, everybody wins.
35:04 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Everybody wins. And right now it’s commoditized in the wrong ways. It’s commoditized for the administrative stuff, right, and that’s what RepTrax or those companies do, is they? You know they allow you to kind of consolidate your applications, your immunizations. You know rep scrubs as if you guys are the problem with scrubs going missing or hospitals losing money. You know, I mean it’s just honestly, I kind of find it demeaning as a person when I have to look at someone wearing a red scrub hat, as if somehow you know that it makes them look like anything but a clown, and you know it’s just that’s what they make the reps do you know that it makes them look like anything but a clown, and you know it’s just that’s what they make the refs do you know in some places you have to wear a red scrub hat, and it’s. You know the goal is the patient. And if the worry is is that you know it’s somehow being commoditized in the wrong way, well, you can. You can, you know, deal with that on a hospital wide level. But that’s not the issue. The issue is everyone is seeking control and control. What I really need is everyone seeking the money, and so you know, that’s why the buyers for the hospitals.
36:09
You know it’s not, it’s not a very standard process. To give you a great example, you know, if you think about it from a business standpoint. To give you a great example, you know, if you think about it from a business standpoint, what is better for a hospital to have a product that works better and costs less or to have a product, just one product. And if you think about it from a patient and a cost perspective, a better product is better for the patient. A cheaper product is better for the hospital. Both they’re very common sense things. However, a lot of hospitals, you know, don’t do that and they have a limit on bringing in new products, you know. So let’s say, you’re a distributor or a rep and you bring me something new and I want to use it. There’s a process.
36:52
Now the FDA approves devices, whether they’re 510K or you know whatever approval they have. So you know it’s an approved device if it’s cheaper than what you’re currently using. You know you have to think what is the hesitation of a hospital or hospital system or an asc to use it? And the reality is someone. Then here’s here’s the problem, here’s why it doesn’t happen. Someone who doesn’t have a high paying job is in control of what’s called the charge master. They have to enter all these SKUs so that the hospital can charge for it. Well, entering all these SKUs is a bunch of menial work that they don’t wanna do, so it’s easier for them not to approve it and to have a higher cost item. That’s maybe not as good for the patient because someone didn’t have to do a low-paying job. That’s boring, right? Because at the end of the day, that’s the reality of if you sell me a screw for $1,000 and there’s another screw that’s available, that’s the same screw for 500 bucks.
37:56
Why can’t I use it? If it’s FDA approved? You know it’s one thing. If these are experimental, you know that’s a different story. But if it’s an FDA approved product, why can’t I use it? It’s not a cost issue, it’s cheaper If it’s just as effective.
38:11
You also have to remember, when we talk about cheaper, a lot of patients still get a medical bill. Their insurance covers 80%, 70%, 50%, but they’re paying a portion of it. So wouldn’t they want to use a better product that’s cheaper? But why is it not being used across the board? And it’s because it’s work to enter these things into a charge master, putting a company, like I might say okay, I want to use this screw In my head I’m thinking how easy of a process it is. However, the company is going to submit 50,000 SKUs to the hospital because every screw size is a SKU, every cap for it is a SKU, every rod is a SKU. You know, and so it’s.
39:00
You know I don’t want to minimize the amount of work that’s being done on the back end, but all of this stuff could easily be standardized.
39:05
Could there not be a national depository of all this information where, when it gets FDA approval, it goes to the central national clearinghouse? You put all your stuff in there and that stuff is then distributed to the hospitals or ASCs or you know OBLs as needed when they approve a product that would drive down the cost of implants? You know the biggest companies don’t like it, obviously, because they usually have, you know, these exclusive contracts and either you know 90% contracts or use 10% other stuff, sort of deal. But you know these are the sort of things where, as a rep, you have to notice, because if you don’t, you could have the best product, you could have the most cost-efficient product, but no one will use it, not because they don’t want to, not because it’s better for the patient, not because it’s cheaper, but because it’s just not in the hospital or ASC system. Skew, you know, charge master, because of this process involved in this.
40:07 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
So keep that in mind. Yeah, where’s the resistance? On the charge master or on the system to get the charge masters to do what needs to be done? Who’s pushing for that advocacy? No?
40:17 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
one. You know there’s a person, usually at most places, that’s entering charges into the charge, or you know that’s building. You know computers were supposed to make. Going back to your understanding, it will all be replaced by AI and computers. Computers are supposed to make our lives easier. Instead, they create so much extraneous information.
40:37
If you look at medical progress notes, they used to be, you know, like surgical notes would be five lines. In those five lines you get all the information you needed. Why is the patient there? How did they do overnight? What are you doing that day? Now a single progress note is like four pages because all the extraneous information is pulled in through the emr. Why is it four pages? Well, when you pull the extraneous information now you get paid more for that same progress note because now it’s it lists every medication, every dosage, it lists all the out.
41:10
You know the old medical problems, which are, which are great. When you first come in you want to know all that stuff do you need on every note. Do need it on every cut and paste note with this information. So not to devolve into why is medicine messed up. But it goes back to how can you really understand the system you’re working in. That’s the key, because you cannot thrive in a system unless you know how it works, because otherwise you’re just a task rabbit. You know you’re sell me. Go sell this widget to as many doctors as you can. You know, this quarter I want you to talk to 12 new surgeons, but if those 12 surgeons can’t use your product, you know, did that necessarily help you in that moment? No, it could have helped build your relationship because you have some touch points. But you know you’re graded on in the moment quotas, not four years down the road, because you built the relationship.
42:10 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
No, you’re right. So then walk us through what it looks like for a rep to take the time to understand this and then use it as leverage to do what needs to be done for their own territory.
42:22 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
So you have to know who makes that decision in the facility or the setting that you’re working in. So you know it’s not as easy as just selling it to me and even me saying, hey, I want to use it. The hospital can still say no, you know, and so it’s understanding. All right, this is talking to your colleagues. This is why you never badmouth people, because they can give you valuable information, but not if they don’t like you because they know that you’re badmouthing them. You talk to your senior people in your, you know, in your region.
42:53
All right, at this hospital system, at Providence, at Banner, you know, whatever system it is, you know who ultimately makes the decision. And I can tell you every distributor and every senior rep in my territory knows who makes a decision at Banner. They know who makes a decision at Dignity. They know who makes a decision at Outer Health. And knowing that will alleviate a lot of frustrations and then also allow you as a new rep, a mid-level rep or even a senior rep to say, all right, I’ve got Dr So-and-so on board, but now the inhibitor is the hospital and that you can flip it on, kind of towards management. That’s your job, you know. To get the skews in. I will sell them, but you have to get them approved and I’ll do my job to help you get them approved, because I’ll find out who you need to get them approved from other than the surgeons, and I’ll give you that information.
43:53 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Would you say that surgery centers you know, right before COVID, I think, surgery centers they were about to explode and then they did and it became the thing. Would you say that you know the bureaucracy we’re talking about in hospitals right now, with what we’re talking about right now with the SKUs? Would you say that the advent of all these surgery centers has relieved some of that and created better avenues for reps to have better access to who they need to get access to and for surgeons to be able to use products they want to use through surgery centers as opposed to the hospital or not?
44:27 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
I think generally the answer is absolutely yes, with the following caveat why doesn’t it work in hospitals? Because you have layers and layers of bureaucracy, administration. You know surgery centers are cheaper, more efficient, better for patient care. They have lower infection rates. They’re meant for a different class of patients than you see in the hospital. Cardiology had originally left the hospitals, went back to the hospitals. Orthopedics is now leading the charge towards ASCs Hopefully neurosurgeons and spine has been following. Pain has always been kind of done in the OBL or outpatient setting. So as long as it’s owned by the physicians, the answer is absolutely, because they can value both patient outcomes and the cost of delivering care.
45:16
The issue lies with all things, which is consolidation and bureaucracy. So a bunch of surgery centers to open a surgery center can be expensive. Not everyone has the capital to do it. So they get into private equity or they get into these national ASV firms that are 51% owners, and the reason they’re 51% owners is you get their insurance contracts in. You don’t have to wait anywhere from 12 to 24 months for the insurance companies to pay you. But when they’re 51% owners now, you get the bureaucracy of a mothership again. So, going back to understanding your playing field. It’s understanding, all right. Who am I working with? Who is the decision maker? Not who’s the loudest, not you know who says they are, but who actually is the decision maker in this process. In ASCs you’re absolutely right In a lot of ASCs that are physician-owned it’s a physician or you know, maybe it’s.
46:14
you know there’s an administrator, a administrator you know, but there’s not like four layers of administrators or one person right one person yeah, of of gatekeepers, right, right right, all right right so uh, hopefully that answered your question indirectly.
46:27 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
No, it did, it did completely, it did completely, so. So so now let’s get, let’s get a little personal, you know, yeah, you’ve been practicing for how long?
46:36 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
I started in 2010, so it’s not my 14th year 14th year, and when do you anticipate hanging it up? I’ll never hang it up. Hang it up, you know, it’s more of I’m not at the point. I would say I’m mid-career. So now I do it because I enjoy it, not because I’m trying to, you know, be the grand poomba of everything.
46:59 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Isn’t that the desire of all surgeons to be the grand poomba?
47:05 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
It is. If you’re title hunting, there’s a lot of titles out there for you. But the old joke goes he who dies with the most toys still dies. So I’d rather enjoy family time and personal time than trying to sit in more meetings.
47:19 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Absolutely, and we’re going to get to that. But before we do, I bring that up because I wanted to talk just a little bit about the sentiment of a surgeon. What I love about about meeting you, doctor, when we met, is, you know, you have, in my opinion, you’re not the most typical of surgeons, but you and you, and you spoke so eloquently to the setup of the different types of surgeons you can experience. If you can just share with the audience, especially for those that that have never been in this space and want to be, what does that look like? You know, what are some things to keep in mind about the the I don’t know the A, the B and the C of a typical neurosurgeon and surgeons that that are in your fields and the C of a typical neurosurgeon and surgeons that are in your fields.
48:03 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
You can probably just watch one of those Dr Glaukenfalken reels and see kind of all the different personalities. But you know, there’s really just like with all fields, there’s a lot of variability. You know, kind of historically or stereotypically people have viewed orthopedics as kind of these like smart jock, smart dumb jocks, which is a funny thing because they obviously were some of the smartest guys and gals in med school to get into those residencies. But the joke is they consult medicine for everything and that’s kind of the stereotypical view. It has been kind of like a bro society. I think that’s broken down more in the last, you know, probably in the last decade, as we’ve had a little more equity, you know, on the gender side at least, going into ortho.
48:49
Neurosurgeons, you know, are typically the way I kind of generalize it and this is a huge generalization, but probably true. You know, ortho is more of a pack mentality. You do have individuals, but the greater good is often more of a factor. Neurosurgeons tend to be more isolated and try to elevate individually rather than collectively. That’s, like I said, a generalization. That’s not true across the board but in pockets that’s more true than others, and they’re usually quieter or louder, more opinionated. But it’s one of those things where this goes back to my very first statement understanding the personality of the person you’re talking to uh, because there’s so much variability and also understanding that personality you’re getting that day may not be their personality. It might be a good day, might be a bad day well said, well said.
49:49 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
you know, one thing I like to do, especially with a guest like yourself, is I want to hear how you structure your, especially when you now have a little bit less time as a clinician and more time to do whatever you want. How do you structure your day? What time are you waking up? Give us a taste of a day in the life of Dr Shao.
50:11 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Since I was in probably fourth or fifth grade, I’ve woken up at 530. Still wake up at 530.
50:16 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
It’s fourth or fifth grade.
50:17 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Yeah, we used to have basketball practice at 6 o’clock. Wow, I think it was in fifth grade. So you know, wake up at 5.30, so we go to basketball practice. So that hasn’t changed Now, instead of going straight to the hospital at 7, you know, now I go to the gym kind of around that time. Come back home just had a new house, so I’ve been doing a lot of uh house things. You know kind of, yeah, thanks, um.
50:45
Then, as I’m sure you do, hundreds and hundreds of emails I sort through and you know I’m uh had thousands. I’m sure. Yeah, only hundreds of mine are applicable. The rest are all junk mail. I got to make sure they’re junk mail. And then there’s, you know, even when you are not in a full-time clinical position, there’s so much clinical paperwork you have to do. I probably spend at least an hour, an hour and a half almost every day doing different credentialing forms. You know, every day doing different credentialing forms. You know different um applications and stuff. And then now that I have, you know, have this like three month break. I’ve gotten a lot of cme done as well.
51:25 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
So very cool. And then you know, I want to know, what do you follow? You know, does, does um, I guess. And let me ask, let me ask a better question what sustains you? You know, everyone, every one of us, has a reason and something that kind of grounds us, or something that we follow or into that helps ground us. What’s it? What’s it for you?
51:43 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
you know, when I was uh young, I used to have this uh goal I wanted to know everything, you know, and I, and I thought it was achievable. When I was young, uh, as I’ve you know, obviously I’ve gotten older, I’ve clearly, uh, I’ve realized, clearly, you cannot know everything, so I try to learn. You know, there’s a Jim Valvano quote I don’t know if you remember him, the NC State coach, when he won the Arthur Ashe Award, he said you know, a good day is a day in which you think, you laugh and you cry. So I think, every day, if you can do those three things, that’s a good day.
52:19 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Oh, look at that, that’s. That’s a gold answer, doctor, that’s a good one. Okay, I received that completely Well, this was fantastic. You know, I loved having you on the show and I think your insights are necessary for for new people and for people seasoned, just to hear what’s really going on behind the mind of of a neurosurgeon that that we call on. So I I thank you for the time today. We’re going to switch gears a little bit and we’re going to jump into the lightning round. Are you ready, sure?
52:48
I’m always ready, I’m going to ask you four questions. You have less than 10 seconds to answer them. Question number one what is the best book you’ve read in the last six months?
52:57 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Let’s see, I probably haven’t read a book in the last six months. I would say probably I just reread Art of War.
53:03 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Okay, why? Why did you reread the Art of War?
53:07 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
When I moved it popped up in my book. So I’m like I haven’t read this in probably two decades. So you know, I just wanted to read it Did it give you any insights into what you, whatever you’re managing in life right now. It always I mean every book gives you insights, and then that’s a that’s a value of a good book, is that?
53:27 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
you can apply it to whatever situation you’re in. So the answer answer is yes, okay, best TV show or movie you’ve seen the last six months the best TV show is.
53:35 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
It’s actually a. It’s dubbed from French but it’s called Lupin, but it’s a great show on Netflix about. I think he’s actually from Senegal, but he’s a Senegal immigrant in Paris who decides.
53:48 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
He’s a con artist right.
53:50 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Well, yeah, he’s a. Yeah, he’s a masterpiece, Not a con artist.
53:55 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
You know, and I need to get it right if I’m going to say it at all- Much respect. You know and I need to get it right if I’m going to say it at all. Much respect. I think I’ve seen an episode but I didn’t get into it. But I’ll have to give it another go. Ok, fantastic. And then last question what is the best meal you’ve had and we want the restaurant and the item Best meal you’ve had in the last six months.
54:14 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
There’s a new restaurant in Scottsdale called Uchi, which is like a it’s Japanese style, not quite sushi, but you know teppanaki sushi. Yakitori has all of them. They have this mushroom fried rice, that’s dynamite.
54:30 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Mushroom. I’ve never even had that mushroom.
54:33 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Okay, I’m not even a vegetarian, yet I picked a vegetarian dish. Well, it has a magnet, okay, okay, that will be in the show notes picked a vegetarian dish.
54:39 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Well, it has a magnet, okay. Okay, that will be in the show notes, folks. Dr Chowdhary, it was awesome having you on the show. We hope to have you back. Keep doing the amazing things you do out there in the neurosurgery world and thank you again.
54:49 – Dr. Abhineet Chowdhary (Guest)
Of course. Thanks, sam, thanks for having me.
54:51 – Samuel Adeyinka (Host)
Absolutely. That was Dr Chowdhary. You know, what I loved about his insights is he really lays the floor, the groundwork for being open to many different types of perspectives. Right, there is no one size fits all for anything that we do, and he makes that abundantly clear. But then he takes it a step further and makes it abundantly clear that you need to take the time to get to know who you’re dealing with. Let’s be honest, folks, this applies to everything. For those of you trying to get into positions, take the time to understand the sales reps, hiring managers and recruiters that you’re talking to as you’re creating your opportunities. For those of you in the field, you better be listening to everything Dr Chaudhary said today, because it’s truly valuable. And for those of you leading the way, how wonderful is it to get insights like what we heard today.
55:44
As always, we do our best to bring you guests who are doing things differently in the medical sales space.
55:48
If you’re someone that wants to get into medical sales, or if you’re someone in medical sales that wants to be better and then provide more value, of course, increase your sales and earn more money, but truly wants to make an even bigger impact, then you already know what I’m going to say go to evolve your successcom.
56:05
Click apply schedule some fill out application schedule some time with one of our account executives and let’s get you on the path to exactly where you want to be. As always, we do our best to bring you guests who are doing things differently in the medical space, so make sure you tune in next week for another episode of the Medical Sales Podcast. I hope you enjoyed today’s episode and remember I have a customized and personalized program that gets you into the medical technology industry as a sales professional or any type of role for that matter. Become a top performer in your position and masterfully navigate your career to executive level leadership. Check out these programs and learn more at EvolvesAssesscom by visiting our site, dealing on an application schedule some time with one of our account executives and allowing us to get you where you need to be. Stay tuned for more awesome content with amazing interviews on the Medical Sales Podcast.
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I was a Regional Sales Representative for Long-Term Care pharmacy services. I had dreamed of getting into the med sales industry when I went into my career as a nurse, but the pharmacy sales job came to me, and I had just settled. Fortunately, I had a job shakeup that allowed me to determine that now was the time to pursue my original vision.
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I would recommend this course to ANYONE looking to break into medical sales
Thank you so much, EYS! This journey has been life changing and has resulted in the successful culmination of my 18-Year ambition! 
Sports Medicine in Phoenix! I extend so much gratitude to the Evolve Your Success group as I land this role and get ready to pursue my dream job. I am a Physical Therapist who became a little stuck in the profession due to issues with reimbursement and the difficulty for continued growth upwards. I turned to EYS to assist me in learning about the medical sales industry and gain knowledgable mentors who were able to help coach me in this process. I am a strong believer in surrounding yourself with the best and good things will happen. I did work hard, but with the support of my mentors and other colleagues going through a career change, I felt a sense of community and it confirmed my drive to get into this industry. I have already learned so much through the interview process, and feel very blessed to have had the resources this group provided. I have made lifelong friends and I cannot wait to continue to follow others’ journeys to pursue this incredible field. I urge you to give Evolve Your Success a try to gain mentorship, guidance, and support through any career transition.
and am excited to make a difference in patients’ lives as a Pharmaceutical Sales Specialist.
! Though I truly enjoyed working as a physical therapist, I can’t wait to start my career in the sales world as a Clinical Account Executive.
. I owe this opportunity to Samuel, the program, and the incredible mentors at EYS.
